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WiJC
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cats in pole shed?
08/29/05 03:56 PM
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I just put up a pole shed. There is no insulation in it, and a crushed limestone floor. Some of the floor where used is getting pretty packed down, and on the edges it is pretty loose yet. (similar to a litter box in appearance)
Anyways...I am looking to possibly get a cat or 2 to take care of any mice problems that may arise. My question is this...will a cat or 2 be able to survive a wisconsin winter in there without any heat? This is assuming I leave them food and water each day. Also, will they just use the crushed limestone on the edges for a litter box even if i put a litter box in there?
Thanks for any info.
John
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Pat
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: WiJC]
08/30/05 10:32 PM
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It may help if you confine the cat with the litterbox for a couple days and then make the same litter box availalbe when in the target building.
With good nutrition and shelter, dare I say it?, a well insulated cat house inside the structure, they could make it. The more you feed them the less they will hunt but how many critters will be out in really bad weather for them to chase?
You could always put a used thrift store heating pad under their bedding to provide extra warmth. If you wire a silicone diode rectifier in series with one of the power leads it will reduce the heat output to a more reasonable level, about 1/2 power. The diode should be rated for more amps than the heating pad by a factor of 2 or so and should have an inverse voltage rating over 200 volts. A diode like this might cost a buck or so at Radio Shack. Put a couple layers of shrink tubing over the diode and the conections to it.
You can buy thermostatic controlled thingies to plug into a regular electric outlet to only turn on the load device when it gets below freezing. These are sold for block heaters on trucks and the like. This would turn the pad on when it got really cold but off when above freezing. These cost a few bucks.
I realize that this is Oklahoma not NODAK or Minn but we have feral cats surving overwinter, living off the land.
 Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
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cwarrix
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: WiJC]
11/23/05 01:03 PM
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Hi John, this old thread caught my eye since I just recently did something similar. Last year my pole barn was FULL of mice, they were everywhere, and left a path of destruction to prove it. It took me four days, on and off over the summer to clean it all up. I love all animals, but man, if I never see another mouse, you won't hear me complain. I tried every trap available at my local home improvement store, only got one mouse on a little sticky trap, which as much as I hate the little critters, seems a little cruel!
Anyway, I decided, even though I'm allergic to cats, a barn cat was the way to go. So, I sent my daughter on a mission to rescue one from the local humane society. She brought our first cat home and we moved hime into his new home. Soon after that, she decided, Shadow was lonely and needed a freind, so I agreed... long story short I have five cats in the barn now!
So far I haven't seen one mouse, except for the dead ones I find now and then in the yard. And for some reason, one of the cats always wants to bring the dead ones up to the house and leave them by the door for me to find. My wife loves that  Funny thing is, we used to have problems with groundhogs, and I didn't see one all summer. No problems with rabbits eating half the garden this year either. I guess the cat thing was a good idea. I do miss the birds though, they don't come around anymore either.
Now for the bad stuff... The cats, even though they have a litter box in the barn, still do their thing on the floor  But at least it is concrete and I can clean it up fairly easy. Still better than cleaning up mouse crap.
Edited by cwarrix (11/23/05 01:21 PM)
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cwarrix
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Cats hard at work protecting my tractor from a mouse attack!
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cowboyjg
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: WiJC]
11/24/05 06:34 AM
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So does that mean y'all are givin shelter to a bunch of "Pole Cats"
"Wisdom isn't free, though your only price is to pay attention"
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midlf
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: Pat]
02/11/06 08:48 PM
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A diode in the AC feed to a heating element will reduce the heat to 1/4 the normal rating. 1/2 the volts will produce 1/2 the amps. Power is volts times amps, thus 1/2 X 1/2 = 1/4
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Pat
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: midlf]
02/12/06 07:46 AM
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midlf, I agree with your math but not your analysis. The heating effect is a result of the time average (Root Mean Square) voltage applied to the resistive element. This is not a peak to peak phenomena! Each half wave contributes 1/2 of the consumed electrical power. A diode elliminates 1/2 of the half waves (in the time domain not voltage.)
The error of your analysis is the assumption that the diode reduces the voltage to 1/2 but IT DOESN'T! The applied voltage is the same but is only there 1/2 of the time.
To more easily visulaize this, consider a full wave rectified sine wave yielding all positive alternations (excursions). The instantaneous voltage now varies from zero to about 165 (117 X 1.414) and back to zero 120 times a second. This voltage applied to a resive element yields the same number of Watts that the original 117 volt AC voltage would have provided (with perfect diodes.)
If 1/2 of the positive alternations are elliminated the power in Watts is halved. This is no different from half wave rectifed power as refered to in my post to which you replied.
There is a significant difference between cutting the duty cycle in half and cuting the applied voltage in half. They are not equivalent. Consider the area under the curve. This area varies in direct proportion to the duty cycle (my example.)
Again, great math, flawed analysis.
Hi and welcome to CBN where we cuss and discuss just about anything with anyone (ostensibly related to one of the topic headings.) This just might be the single best site on the whole bloomion' infobahn. Credit is due in no small measure to the CREATOR, Hakim, from whom we hear very little but know he is lurking out there.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
Edited by Pat (02/12/06 08:04 AM)
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midlf
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: Pat]
02/14/06 02:01 PM
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Duh on my part. You are correct. I was getting it confused with my other trick, putting the two halves of a king electric blanket in series to make a winter cover for the motorcycle (prevents condensation). Thanks for catching it.
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Pat
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: midlf]
02/15/06 02:55 PM
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midlf, Hey, no worries, mate. I suppose the blanket is a dual control type that is two totaly separate circuits and you put the two halves in series to run it cooler. I'm guessing, but I suppose you use one of the thermostats to control the lashup.
If each half of the blanket was 1000 Ohms then each side would produce about 14.4 Watts when it's 'stat was calling. The two in series would produce 7.2 Watts. I never had a "Dew Chaser" for a bike but it seems to be a clever idea. I have a dew preventer for the corrector plate (objective lense) of my 8 inch telescope. Runs on 12 volts.
I got the instructions for weaving wire through a set of long handle underwear to make an electrically heated motorcycle suit for cold weather riding (good for snowmobiling too.) You use a duty cycle controler to turn the power on and off to achieve variable heating. Winter was way too warm here this time so I didn't get motivated to make up a set but could sure use them in my VW powered dune/beach buggy which has no heat. Powered by 12 volts they aren't a shock danger.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
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slapshot
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: WiJC]
02/16/06 11:48 AM
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We just had a very friendly stray move into our garage. He has no idea what to do with the litter box. We also re-topped out driveway with limestone screenings. He does know what to do with that 
-dave
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ericinok
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: slapshot]
02/09/07 03:31 PM
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I finally convinced my wife that letting a cat or two live in our barn is not considered cruelty to animals. Well, she sent out feelers for a couple of fixed cats to live in our barn. Now, it looks like we'll be getting FIVE!! I just wanted two. Careful what you wish for.
My question is what are the chances that a couple of these find other homes they like better or find a coyote that is hungry? I have no plans to drive them off, but I do expect to lose one or two to nature. All have been fixed and have shots. As far as shelter, I was gonna get a couple of pieces of plywood and build them a basic box with a small, dog-proof hole for them to get it. Any other suggestions (other than not to overfeed)?
*** What we've got here is failure to communicate ***
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Pat
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: ericinok]
02/12/07 11:25 AM
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Eric, I have seen cats (dumped pets or their offspring) survive multiple winters living off the land with no shelter. I have seen them hunting with snow on the ground. Surely your cats will have a decent chance at survival. I might insulate their box and try to provide water (if none available) and like you said NOT overfeed them. The hardy and smart will probably do just fine. Coyotes don't take many cats that aren't defective.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
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aussie
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: Pat]
02/12/07 11:54 AM
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I find any more than 3 cats creates so much pecking-order angst that at least two or three leave. We have had three for the last 10 years and they still have a fight now and then (all desexed) Without cats, living on a aussie farm, the house gets huge bush rats coming inside, and if rat bait is used they die in the walls and stink for a week. Great things, cats.
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ericinok
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: aussie]
02/13/07 05:08 PM
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aussie-
Your cats stand on two legs and have pouches, don't they? Sorry, I just had to throw an Australia stereotype at you. What the heck is a bush rat, and how big do they get? They sound down right scary. Are your cats normal sized, or do you guys grow 'em a little bigger there? It's neat to talk to someone clear around the world about barn cats.
We got one last Friday and fixed him up in a stall. I went to check on him this weekend and found out that we already had a barn cat that I didn't know about. He gave the dog a good scare and the chase was on. I'm pretty sure he belongs to the neighbors behind us. I'm hoping the other four we were promised don't materialize. "I hate the smell of cat poop in the morning".
*** What we've got here is failure to communicate ***
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aussie
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: ericinok]
02/13/07 09:37 PM
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No, in fact our cats down here are just like yours- except from that bare patch on their backs ( from being upside down all the time). That pic on the icon is our house, and although it's small you can see that there is plenty of bush around. Bush rats are about a foot long, and what can I say, they are a rat, but a very hardy variety. The ones the crocs, stingrays, dingos, paralysis ticks, goannas, deadly snakes,venemous spiders, sharks and poisonous jellyfish don't get are, of course, real survivors 
Seriously, goannas, a iguna or monitor lezard that grows to around five feet long and with a body a foot thick are a real danger to cats when they are small. They come in the house sometimes after the dry catfood.
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: WiJC]
03/16/07 03:42 AM
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We have the same problem... Nice barn, two barn cats, no mice or other critters and limestone screenings on the floor. When the ground froze outside, the cats started doing their thing in the barn... how can I stop that, other than locking them out of the barn? For me, there isn't much worse than the smell of cat mess.
If anyone has a suggestion as to how to stop the cycle, it would be appreciated. We have gotten a litter box and hope that they will use it, but I don't see why they will, when the floor is where they have already claimed as their litterbox.
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Marie
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There are 2 things I know of that can cause a cat to go outside the litterbox. They're really picky about clean litter, some more than others... so it's important to scoop out the waste daily, and change the litter and wash the pan when it starts to get stinky and loses it's ability to knock out the odors. Adding baking soda helps.
The other thing, which I suspect may be the case, if it's just urine that's being done outside the box, is scent marking. If a male is un-neutered, he will spray to mark his terriotory, especially if there are other cats in the vicinity. That makes quite the stink. 
Females are known to do it too, but it's far more common in un-neutered males whom will literally get into a "pissing contest," To establish territorial dominance. The only real solution is to get them neutered. It's best to do this when they are kittens because sometimes, once the behavior is established, neutering won't completely eradicate it.
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Marie
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Re: cats in pole shed?
[re: cwarrix]
03/30/07 10:40 AM
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The mice left by the door, are for you. Cats will occasionally bring home a "treat" for their owners.
I always act pleasently surprised and praise the kitties when they do it...( WOW! A Mousie! For me??? YUM! How thoughtful! How did you know mousie is my favorite?)
Meanwhile the cat is parading around, proudly meowing about it's trophy-gift. No doubt giving me a paw by paw description of the successful hunt.
Then as soon as they're out of sight, discreetly place said mousie outside.
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