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CJDave
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Reged: 10/21/02
Posts: 860
Loc: Southeast Iowa
OK!!!! That DOES IT!!!
      08/21/06 05:23 AM

After months of getting up early and scratching the yick and the gick out of my eyes so I could peer at the monitor and count the number of posts, I have finally documented an instance where PAT has exceeded the limits of all propriety and decorum by having his post name on THIRTEEN out of the TWENTY-FOUR categories. I'm going to immediately contact his employer and advise them that Pat is taking company time to surf the net. If he is posting here then it's a cinch that he's on e-bay, the shopping internet, the FWD after market accessory catalogs, and auto trader dot com. He no doubt has one of those clandestine software programs where you push a certain key and a fake spreadsheet pops up to fake out the boss when he walks by Pat's coobickle. Who knows what vital company work is languishing because Pat is on the net instead of on the job.

CJDave

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egon
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Reged: 09/12/02
Posts: 3031
Loc: Nova Scotia,Canada
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/21/06 06:42 AM


Don't worry CJ; Pat's boss is onto every little scam he tries!

Egon

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JazzDad
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Reged: 10/29/02
Posts: 551
Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/21/06 08:03 AM

Dave, don't worry about it. Pat works for NORAD, and is keeping a close eye on those OTHER screens while he is on the 'net.

All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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GaryM
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Reged: 09/12/02
Posts: 1212
Loc: Warrenton, MO
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/21/06 10:40 AM

I know Pat's secret!

You've heard of the eBay snipeing programs, the ones that come in at the last minute and add your bid just before the close?

Well, Pat has a Post Sniping Program. he has a list of posters and whenever someone on the list makes a post, Pat's program jumps in and adds one of his!

Doesn't much matter what's in the post being sniped, Pat has lots of cannned posts for most any topic.

Water treatment? No Problem!
Concrete Houses? no Problem!



Gary
----------------------------------------------
Hey! Aren't you supposed to be working?

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: GaryM]
      08/21/06 03:33 PM

Gary, You promised for consideration previously negotiated that you would not reveal my proprietary secrets. I am shocked to see that you are not a man of your word.

As regards talking to my boss... OK what do you want to say to me? If you want to talk to my bosses boss that is harder to arrange since my wife doesn't talk to strange men (other than me.)

And while we are on the topic of bosses... Some define boss as he who pays you. That is a frightening thought as I am paid by the US taxpayer and there are still a lot of those!

Can I get some slack because I am: 1. retired, 2 it is so hot outside I have to quit outside labor well in advance of lunch. This leaves few stimulating activities (forget TV, I have to be much more tired and near brain death to stand for much TV (decent SCI FI excepted but recorded for delayed viewing.)

Anyway, thanks for the attention guys. The more you discuss me the more I feel noticed.

When I take a break from shop work or whatever, CBN is one of the first choices for a diversion. TBN is about 3rd.

Dave, as the one who started this thread does that qualify you as my very own groupie??? Make a list of all the other contributers (except me of course) to this thread and youi can try to sign them up as charter members of my fan club. Dues are up to you and whatever you think you can scam. I don't want any $ out of it. The ego massage is invaluable, so much so that I may call Tony and Rocko and cancel the "intense interest" I generated in Gary's well being.

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


Edited by Pat (08/21/06 03:37 PM)

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GaryM
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Reged: 09/12/02
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Loc: Warrenton, MO
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/21/06 04:26 PM

Does that make me a "person of interest?"

I had noting to do with whatever went wrong!

Gary
----------------------------------------------
Hey! Aren't you supposed to be working?

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CJDave
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Reged: 10/21/02
Posts: 860
Loc: Southeast Iowa
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: GaryM]
      08/22/06 04:51 AM

I like that idea of having pre-recorded computerized responses to every possible posting. I'm thinking of marketing a device for phones. It is a cradle that the receiver sets in and has a sound-activated relay that remains open while sound emits from the receiver. As soon as the sound quits, it plays a selection of pre-recorded sounds like Uh-huh; oh yeah, ummmm-humm, you betcha, you got that right, I just cannot believe that, is that a fact, un-believeable, and then back to uh huh. It is perfect for those long drawn out: "She said, then I said, then she said......" phone calls from your tiresome cousin-in-law or other equally whacked-out individuals. You just lay the receiver in the cradle and go about your business. The relay does the work.

CJDave

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JazzDad
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Reged: 10/29/02
Posts: 551
Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/22/06 08:23 AM

Really, Dave? Is that so? Tell us more. That is very interesting. I heard of folks doing that before. I've thought of doing that. If I had the money, I'd do that.

All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/22/06 10:54 AM

Jazz, Decades back there was an embryonic free association softwarre entitled ELIZA. She asked questions yoi gave answers and yoiu got additional guestions formed with some of the words you used. For example if you said I'm worried, she'd ask why are you worried? You say about death and taxes and she'd say tell me about your concerns with death and taxes... and on and on.

Since there are some pretty good and not too expensive text to voice and voice to text applications available you could feed an incoming call into a voice to text program and pipe it to Eliza. Her responses could be piped to the text to voice program and fed to the phone. Phone solicitors and such would be a good target in addition to Dave's cousin-in-law. If the source is available we could customize it for talking on the phoine to whatever target groups were of interest.

This is not that hard and would probably sell. I have no interest in marketing but someone else might. The idea isn't that complicated and the programing is not above advanced high school capability.

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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egon
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Reged: 09/12/02
Posts: 3031
Loc: Nova Scotia,Canada
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/22/06 11:08 AM


Why complicate things. Just do not answere the phone!

Egon

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JazzDad
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Reged: 10/29/02
Posts: 551
Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: egon]
      08/22/06 11:26 AM

That's a good way to deal with phone solicitors. (But I suspect Egon gives them @x7!^.)

All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: egon]
      08/22/06 02:15 PM

Right Egon, Don't answer the phone so the once in a while call you don't want won't bug you. Then your wife and her friends will rebel and you will be lucky if they only burn you in effigy.

Here is a link to one version of Eliza...

http://www-ai.ijs.si/eliza-cgi-bin/eliza_script

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


Edited by Pat (08/22/06 02:17 PM)

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egon
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Reged: 09/12/02
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/22/06 02:47 PM


Sorry Jass Dad.

Its " Not interested " and when the sales pitch tries to resume it's " Not interested " and they hang up.

Heck; they are only trying to make a living.

Egon

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GaryM
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Reged: 09/12/02
Posts: 1212
Loc: Warrenton, MO
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: egon]
      08/22/06 07:15 PM

I had a gal call me a few years back about a Master Card or something. I listened a minute and said "You're at work, right?" She said yes. I then said "Well, I'm at home, so why don't you give me your home number and tomorrow when i'm at work I'll give you a call and we can talk about it?"

Hello? Hello?

Gary
----------------------------------------------
Hey! Aren't you supposed to be working?

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JazzDad
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Reged: 10/29/02
Posts: 551
Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: GaryM]
      08/23/06 08:04 AM

I'm going to bring this thread back around to where it started: Pat's by and large monopolization of this website. So, I propose a contest. Let's come up with a hobby for Pat. For the last few years it was building his house. Now??? I suggest Pat gets into building ships in bottles. No, knowing Pat they would be full-scale models in ridiculously large glass containers. OK CBNers, what is your offer to keep Pat busy these days?

All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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egon
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Reged: 09/12/02
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Loc: Nova Scotia,Canada
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/23/06 09:01 AM


I would think he should be giving internet tutoring to individuals in need of tutoring.

Egon

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/23/06 10:56 PM

Sorry Jazz, Sloppy restatement. Read Dave's post again. The main thrust of it is my AUTOMATED response system.

Egon, Can you handle my rates?

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


Edited by Pat (08/23/06 10:56 PM)

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egon
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/24/06 05:54 AM


Most would say I'm a little too challenged to even bother with remedial action.

Not kowing your rate system that question is rather moot and beleive me I'm in the category where I do have to ask what it costs!

But in all seriousness would it not be possible to set up a computer based voice assited tutoring system? Screen and voice at the same time.

Egon




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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: egon]
      08/25/06 02:11 PM

Egon, I'm not sure if you want the computer to talk to you or if you want a remote mentor to talk to you while you are on your computer. Both are possible, and not so hard with Windows OS.

For the sake of this discussion I will take the second premise as your intent. There are See U See Me systems with innexpensive CDD video cameras and audio. When two users connect in cyberspace they get to see each other and talk to each other. Some of the systems let you see each other but converse by typing messages. Anyway with a windowing system like the MS Windows OS you can have that communicatiions applicatioin running in one window and another application of interest in another window, say MS Excel spreadsheet for example. YOu are trying to do something in the spreadsheet and can communicate about it with the remote mentor.

BUT WAIT!!! THERE IS MORE!!! MS WIndoze (I'm not a big fan of Gates) can allow you to let a remote mentor operate your computer from their remote location. YOu have to "GIVE PERMISSION" to allow the session. There is a protocol where you send a request from your computer to the remote mentor and then if they are available they can "do a Vulcan mind meld" (you are a Treckie arent you?) with your computer. This is a great way for a mentor to help someone run a program without having to be at the same physical location. I'm not sure which version of Windows was first to incorporate this feature or if it will work if both mentor and student don't have the same version (at least major release if not x.y.z.

I am aware of this feature but have not personally used it.

I am running MS Windows XP Pro 5.1 Service pack 2, a relatively current version of XP as I have enabled the automated update via the web feature. IF you are running a version that predates or otherwise does not include that feature it might be worth your while considering the upgrade since it opens up the mentoring opportunity.

I'm sure you recall the extremely high price you requested from us for the artifact you shipped. Well, I'm afraid I'd have to get at least that much per hour or portion thereof for a mentoring service. The good news is that you could get mentoring from any of your computerized friends who have the requisite operating system.

There are VOIP (Voice Over Internet Protocol) systems, some of which are share ware or freeware. These allow you to talk over the computer to a remote computer user with no long distance charges as the phone companies are not involved. You need innexpensive hardware GOtta have spoeaker and microphone like a telephone to talk and listen, of course. The quality is a tad variable and rough at times but it is "free." You can then at least talk to someone and use your computer at the same time even if you only have one phone line available at your location.

I had two lines, one for talking and one for computer dial up connection but dropped the second line after I got DSL as it allows a high speed broadband computer connection and voice over the same phone line with no interferrence.

With VOIP, both users have to run the VOIP software. SKYPE is a popular one. For a small fee you can make calls to folks who don't have computers. You still talk via your computer and the signal is converted to a regular phone signal near the location of the person you call and goes to them from that point as a regular phone call. You have to pay any toll or access charges plus a fee to the provider of the VOIP service. It can still be significantly cheaper than regular long distance.

So Egon, there you have it, several ways to be able to be "on the net" with your computer and talk to someone at the same time.

I think this technology is important to but underutilized by rural folks (and others.)

It is yet another chunk of technology to have to learn to use but it isn't all that tough. None of the above is FOR GEEKS ONLY and can be used by most school kids from later grade school on and has been.

I'm not claiming to be expert on these topics as this is one of the areas of knowlege where my breadth way exceeds my depth. We probably have folks lurking here who know more by accident on these topics than I will know on purpose. I'm just pointing out some of the directions someone could go to use only one phone line and be able to use the computer on the net at the same time as talking on the phone (via computer.)

I would attempt to answer any questions on these topics but issue this caveat in advance, it is likely my answer may have to be, "I don't know."

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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egon
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/25/06 02:38 PM

I must appologise for my lack of communication clarity Pat.

Does that mean you are too busy to set up a remote mentoring for advanced students?

I do beleive I was thinking of people at each end of the computer with a system that would allow voice as well as key board communication. It could also work as a group class with all being at different locations. Perhaps the University of the future. There just have to be some such systems already in operation.

Egon

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: egon]
      08/25/06 03:20 PM

Egon, Google on distance learning. There is a wealth of disparate distance learning situations ranging from simple to complex. You can earn accredited degrees via distance learning via the web. The web is a very powerful force for training and education. Distance learning was one of my topics of interest during my last stint in grad school ( Instructional Technology San Diego State Univeresity 1994) and in my job for the last several years prior to retirement. It was one of the things I pushed for prior to my retirement. I tried to sell it to varying levels of Navy and DoD. You have to have an educated and interested sales prospect because of the way technology is integrated into the process.

I set the stage for distance learning to be used in several Navy situations (I worked in a DoD lab under Navy control. We had a civilian technical director but a Navy Captain as Commanding Officer.)

Everything you have mentioned from one on one mentoring to group classes via networked computers (local net or WWW) has been done. You said. "There just have to be some such systems already in operation. " You have made a very correct assumption and if you Googled on distance learning and or distance education or whatever you would see a wealth of different applicatioins of distance learning.

In the Navy (and othere situations) it is costly to send someone to a school. Maybe you lose his service onboard a ship which can be a bad thing plus the cost of flying him to the school, putting him up, and on and on. Schedulling can be a nightmare. If a course can be taken via a computer, either canned or live interactive from the ship via internet satellite connectivity, you save all lthe costs of logistics that ensue from the physical dislocation plus your guy is still on board to consult with anyone about his specialty and if the ballon goes up, he is there to man his watch station.

One of my early Navy jobs was with the Fleet Combat Training Center, Pacific. I designed and help program a courseware authoring system for Navy instructors to use to design and author training materials to be presented by computer onboard ship. THis was for certain warfighting systems operated by folks called OS (Operational Specialists who direct air ops and get to help shoot things down with other weapons on board) Anyway different versions had to be supplied to every platform (ship) which is a configuratioin control challenge and extra work. If the courseware was hosted on a website and accessed from anywhere in the world via the net it woud have simplified the process a big bunch but one of the Navy mottos is "over two hundred years of tradition, unencumbered by progress." This sort of training started prior to good internet connectivity and continued in this fashion due to inertia as much as anything else.

The traditioin/progress comment is supposed to be funny but sometimes wasn't.

Did you see the movie, "Blast From the Past?" Your comments like "Perhaps the University of the future." and questions regarding distance learning remind me of the main character.

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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JazzDad
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/25/06 04:25 PM

Hey, now. This looks like good, solid information. What happened to my contest?

All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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andrewy
New Member

Reged: 11/30/05
Posts: 13
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/25/06 08:26 PM

I too have been amazed at that posting volume of Pat. I've often wondered if "Pat" were actually an AI somewhere on the net that has taken an interest in country life. Perhaps we should adminster a 'turing' test.

AndrewY

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lovethesticks
Member

Reged: 03/24/06
Posts: 52
Loc: Southwest Michigan
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/25/06 11:12 PM

Dearest CJDave - I believe you might be in need of a new hobby as well. When I last posted a question to CBN, I addressed it to Pat and Egon. Just regret that I left out Gary LOL! If I post a question in the future, would you like me to address it to you as well? Don't want to leave anyone out! Chris

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CJDave
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Reged: 10/21/02
Posts: 860
Loc: Southeast Iowa
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: lovethesticks]
      08/26/06 01:34 AM

In terms of hobbies, I'll tell you how whacked out I actually am.... ... If given the choice of: "Going to play golf at Pebble Beach; or stay home and mount an alternator in place of the generator on my recently-acquired 1948 Case tractor"; it would be the tractor. Somehow, I forgot to learn how to play as hard as I work; but in defense I have to add that the condition does seem to be OK for me; it hasn't brought on any negative health issues or caused me to become a recluse. It IS hard to resist posting, and since I'm kind of an "alternate sleeper"; good one night and not-so-good the next; the compooter is a way to spend the awake time; especially when it's five below out there and the wind is blowing.

CJDave

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: andrewy]
      08/27/06 11:50 AM

Andrew, That Should be Turing test. Oh by the way, it isn't polite to make fun of Eliza and any other of her kind just because they don't fog a mirror.

Apparently a defacto Turing test has been administered, and passed, since there is speculation with no certaintude regarding the related factors.

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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JazzDad
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Reged: 10/29/02
Posts: 551
Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: andrewy]
      08/28/06 08:14 AM

Andrew, now you're getting into the quandary of whether Artificial Intelligence is truly "thinking", or merely a programmed response, albeit quite complex.


All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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andrewy
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Reged: 11/30/05
Posts: 13
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/28/06 08:27 AM

Ah, the eternal question about silicon vs. meat intelligence. I guess I believe that some day, there will an artificial intelligence at least as smart as a human. As far as programming goes, weren't we all 'programmed' by our parents and society on an OS written by God?

A

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Pat
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: JazzDad]
      08/28/06 04:30 PM

JazzDad, Does a response achieved by programing, however complex, indicate intelligence or sentience? Is intelligence not the result of programing, in either machines or people? Where and how do you draw the line?

Alan Turing, considered the father of modern computer science, proposed the famous "Turing test" in which a human judge carries on a natural language conversation (text entry and output is acceptable) in the blind with two entities, one human and one machine. If the judge cannot reliably discern which is the human and which is the machine then the machine is judged to be sentient.

You may quible about any number of personal conceptions but the universe of computer science and many other disciplines embraces the Turing test as proposed.

Whether you accept the Turing test, as is, or you draw a "line in the sand" at a different location than Alan Turing did, at some point you have to pick a set of criteria that, if met, indicates sentience and then accept the result when achieved. It isn't responsible science to keep changing the rules because you don't like the outcome.

There is the argument of the beard. If I have one long hair on my chin we might agree it doesn't constitute a beard. OK, how about 2, 10, 100, 1000? At some point most reasonable men would agree I had a beard. Whatever the criteria, at some point reasonable men would agree that a machine displayinig certain capabilities was sentient. Computer scientists and artificial intelligence researchers (not neccessarily the same thing) fairly universally accept the Turing test as that criterion.

What is human thought if not the result of quite complex programing?

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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CJDave
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Reged: 10/21/02
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Loc: Southeast Iowa
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/29/06 05:35 AM

What about the bred-in ability....or lack of ability.....to be programmed? How does the Turing Test adjust for those kinds of differences in humans? How about a very intelligent individual who is simply not sentient? Who goes their own way regardless of how much input they receive? I suppose the question might be: "Are all smart people trainable?"

CJDave

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JazzDad
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Loc: South Central Texas
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/29/06 08:06 AM

Dave, may I take your thought one step further? Who defines 'smart'? Doesn't the bushman see the rocket scientist as a ignorant, and vice versa?
Muhammad, perhaps we need PBN- PhilosophyByNet?


All kids are gifted; some just open their packages earlier than others.-Michael Carr

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Pat
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/29/06 10:51 AM

Dave, I think we need to negotiate a common understanding of sentience, a shared definition, if you will. Often people are in virtual violent agreement on something but because of differences in meaning of certain key words and phrases central to the discuasion they will argue about nonexistant differences. Even if folks don't agree in the main to the key features of a discussion, it still makes the exploration of their differences easier and less frustrating if there is agreement on terms.

Sentient and sentience are terms that are often used by different people to mean quite different things. For a good deep belly laugh take a look here:

www.sentientbeings.org/

These are the Susan Sarandon type of idiots who want farm animals accorded full rights of citizenship.

From the American Heritage Dictionary

SYLLABICATION: sen·tience
PRONUNCIATION: snshns, -sh-ns
NOUN: 1. The quality or state of being sentient; consciousness. 2. Feeling as distinguished from perception or thought.


1) sentient. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.
...1. Having sense perception; conscious: The living knew themselves just sentient puppets on God's stage (T.E. Lawrence). 2. Experiencing sensation or feeling. Latin...

2) sentience. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.
...1. The quality or state of being sentient; consciousness. 2. Feeling as distinguished from perception or thought....

Given these well accepted meanings for sentient and sentience and a careful review of your post, I can't see the sense of what you are saying.

If the above definitions are accepted then some of your remarks may be self contradictory (and some of the rest are non-sequitors irrespective of the definitions of the terms.)

I'm sure you have some very interesting information, understanding, and surmise that you are intending to communicate, I just don't see how it relates to sentience. For example: You said, "Are all smart people trainable?" Define smart, define trainable. Then we may discuss the question posed profitably with no cross purposes. It might be interesting and illuminating, especially if you could show relevance to sentience. Neither smartness or trainabilitiy are conditioins for sentience.

Another question is, Can dead men vote twice? Interesting perhaps, full of meaning, hidden to the uninitiated but also not related to sentience or its definition.

LIke Eli the Ice man, "can dead men vote twice" is a pneumonic device, in this instance for remembering the relationship bewteen: compass, deviatioin, magnetic, variation, and true.

What has the last example to fo with sentience? It is my assertion that it has as much to do with it as your training and smart question which is precisely nothing. Interesting, just not self evident that it is on the topic.

It would be interesting indeed if you would show relevance in a straight forward easilly understood manner.



Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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CJDave
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Reged: 10/21/02
Posts: 860
Loc: Southeast Iowa
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/29/06 01:42 PM

Stuff like this drives me nuts. That's why I can never go near philosophy....YEEK! I give up!

CJDave

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egon
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Reged: 09/12/02
Posts: 3031
Loc: Nova Scotia,Canada
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/30/06 06:24 AM


It's the heat Dave, those two fellows have been confined to air conditioned premessis all summer and are going stir crazy. Perhaps some of the recirculating air is also going bad and haveing deleterious effects on the synapse responses!


I just hope no permanent damage has been done.

Egon

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
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Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/30/06 07:55 AM

Dave, You mentioned some very interesting topics, I only pointed out how they didn't seem connected to sentience.

Interestingly enough, Alan Turing (father of modern computer science) was one of the heroes of the British WW II effort to crack the code of the German's Enigma machine. However, certain acts between even consenting adults of the same sex were illegal in England so he also became a convicted sex offender.

Hmmm, philosyphobia huh? My dad once told me the epitome of uselessness in education was a doctor of philosophy degree (Phd) in philosophy. I'm sure there is some good to come of that stuff, sometimes it isn't apparent to me.

You say stuff like this "DRIVES" you crazy... for me it would be just a short putt.

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


Edited by Pat (08/30/06 07:56 AM)

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lovethesticks
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Reged: 03/24/06
Posts: 52
Loc: Southwest Michigan
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/30/06 05:24 PM

Geeze am so sorry it is five below and blowing in Nebraska right now LOL. Or have you been working and playing so hard that you neglected to notice the summer? I have really been enjoying the posting that has followed your initial statement, thanks for the fun! Chris

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CJDave
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Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: Pat]
      08/30/06 05:58 PM

Yeah, I recognized Turings name. His work saved a LOT of allied lives. Patton was right: "Whatever else man does pales compared to war." ...or at least a statement to that effect. It IS true that nowhere else do you see the EFFORT expended as you do in warfare.

CJDave

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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
Posts: 4904
Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
Re: OK!!!! That DOES IT!!! new [re: CJDave]
      08/31/06 02:15 PM

Right again Dave. It is unfortunate but true that conflict resolution by other means short of war gets such a small amount of energy earnestly applied. It is as if everyone is programed to believe that since they can prevail in battle they need not risk any losses through compromise at any negotiations. Of course all sides often believe they will win but instead frequently all parties loose.

I personally think that our nations best interests are often served when others are also winners. I think we should clearly state our policy and intent such that other nations and their leaders don't have to consult a Ouija board to devine our intent. Once we have selected a "FAIR" course we should stick to it as much as evolving circumstances permit.

When someone needs their toes stepped on we shouid not shriink from doing it. When someone needs help we should lnot shrink from helping. We need to do that which is required to develop credibility. It is far less important that we are liked by all nations than we are respected by all and trusted to keep our word either in friendship or armed conflict if required. We need to make the criteria to draw our UNFRIENDLY attention very clear, like a parent with their children, establish clear firm guidelines as to permisible conduct and be willling to back our position as required. //RANT MODE OFF//

Pat

"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"


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