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RichZ
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Using T-Posts for Fencing
03/05/03 07:55 AM
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The fencing in my paddock and pasture is made up of locust posts with three rails, each made up of 1 by 8's. Many of the locust posts are starting to rot, and I've got to replace whole sections this spring. The original owners of my farm (who now own the next farm) tell me that most of these posts are only five years old. The ground is pretty damp, as a stream goes through one end of the pasture. At one end of the pasture is an old barbed wire fence that I'm replacing made of T-posts and barbed wire. The T-posts are over 20 years old and still in good shape.
Since the T-posts lasted much longer than the locust posts, I was wondering if I could use them as fence posts. I could attach the wood planks to them with U bolts. It seems logical, but since I've never seen a fence constructed this way, I figure that I must be missing something, and it's probably a bad idea.
It just seems like it would be easy to construct and last. So what does everyone think? It can't be that easy, right? 
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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brosil
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/05/03 08:21 AM
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Why boards? Are you fencing horses?
I'm using a woven wire fence for my sheep and occasional cattle. There are a number of fencing systems for horses that are easir and maybe cheaper. I think Ramm Fence has an online catalog. They have some wire reinforced vinyl that might work.
I hope you have power equipment. My sheep pasture just about killed me but maybe you're younger.
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: brosil]
03/05/03 08:31 AM
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Thanks, I should have been more explicit. Yes this is for horses. The reason I don't want to use electric fence exclusively is because if the fence shorts out, one of our horses will walk right through it. She's always testing the electric fences, and if it's not working she'll go through it. So, I thought I'd stay with the three board design, with a hot wire on top to keep them from messing with it, at least when it's on. 
Rich
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cowboydoc
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/05/03 08:46 AM
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I'd use woven wire horse fence. Then put two strands of smooth wire on the top and electrify it. About every 50ft. put in a wood post for stability. If you ever have to replace one it will be a piece of cake. Get good treated posts. The reason those posts rotted is because they probably weren't treated. That fencing will be even safer than the boards..
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: cowboydoc]
03/05/03 09:02 AM
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Thanks, Richard. But the one question I have is, is the woven wire strong enough to hold the horses when the inevitable shorts occur, and short out the fence? We have it happen from branches falling on the fence, deer running through it, and even the horses dropping hay on it (it's almost like they know they can short it out!).
My Belgian will touch the fence with her nose a few times each day. If she doesn't get a shock, she'll lean on it until it gives. She never takes off, she just seems satisfied that she can break the wire. That's why I was going to use the boards.
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/05/03 09:26 AM
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Wait till you see what she will do to 1 by's when she has a itch.bcs  
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: Justaplain]
03/05/03 09:35 AM
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Welcome to my world!!!  I'm always replacing boards on the fence, due to her various itches. Amazingly, the quarter horses don't cause a problem, but the Belgian sure does. But with three boards, if she wrecks one, I just replace it, and the other two are enough of a barrier to keep everyone inside. I'm just worried if I go to all wire, she'll just walk right through it.
When the electric fence is working, one hot wire on top does keep them off the fence. But when it shorts out, that's when I have problems.
Rich
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MikePA
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/05/03 11:20 AM
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Afternoon, Rich!
I had the same problem. We have a 4 rail (1" x 6") fence. That the horses just loved to scratch and push on. I ran a single electric tape at the top, inside of the fence and they don't get near it now.
I used HorseGuard Fencing and love it. I didn't care for the wire or the narrow tape. It can be attached to T-Posts as well as wooden posts. They even offer slip on covers for the T-posts. Visit the site and peruse the alternatives. Serge is very responsive to questions, prompt shipping, etc.
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
03/05/03 11:48 AM
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Thanks, Mike!!! I just ordered their free catalogue and samples!! 
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
03/05/03 11:59 AM
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I've noticed everyone is going to the tape. What is the main benefit? Is it stronger, easier to install?
Steve
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MikePA
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Evening, Steve. I've never installed anything but the tape I mentioned in an earlier post, so I can't comment on other the electric fence alternatives. The tape was very easy to install. The only tools I needed were a cordless drill (drill holes for some lag screws and as a screwdriver to mount the plastic doohickies that hold the tape) and scissors to cut the tape. Nothing special to tension the tape, nothing special to splice it.
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Stoneheartfarm
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
03/05/03 05:39 PM
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Mike,
Sounds easier to install. I've noticed more and more shelf space devoted to tape and tape hangers. I figured there has to be a reason. Thanks.
Steve
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/05/03 07:17 PM
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Rich,
It will hold most anything in. It's special woven wire just for horses. It's 60" tall and is spaced for horses so they don't get their legs in it. It will stop them and you won't be replacing boards. Tape definitely won't stop them. I don't like the tape, no offense Mike, as if you ever have one run into it it will break. Plus after a few years you are replacing it again.
Then just put two strands of smooth wire on top and you will be set for the next 30 years. It will keep your belgian and anything else in. It's the cheapest, most durable, and safest way to go in my opinion. Your other option is high tensile fence but I know how you like to be the safest you can. I've seen horses run into the woven wire fencing and just bounce off none the worse for wear. If you decide to go with it make sure and get the red brand label kind. It's the good stuff. Don't get the cheap stuff. It won't hold up and will even break when you are stretch it.
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: cowboydoc]
03/06/03 07:35 AM
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That sounds great, Richard!! Just what I'm looking for. One last question, what's the name of the type you use? Do they have a website, and where do you buy it, I've never seen it.
Oops, I guess that was three questions!!
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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cowboydoc
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/06/03 07:57 AM
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Rich,
I"m not sure if they have a website. I'm sure they probably do. The brand is called Red Brand. I see it all the time in alot of the horse magazines.
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: cowboydoc]
03/06/03 08:22 AM
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Richard, thanks!!! I'll get it from the magazines. I get several, but my favorite is Western Horseman, which you reccommended!!
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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LazyJ_Arabians
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
03/06/03 08:55 AM
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They got a good website, www.redbrand.com .
I have used the 48" 2x4 mesh non-climb on several projects. It's heavy, stiff, and a bear to work with but makes a lifetime fence. There is an inside/outside to the wire, make sure you put the smooth side of the knot towards the horse. And it's important to stretch it tight as a fiddle string so a pawing horse can't get a purchase on it. About 85 cents a foot at my local farm coop.
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: cowboydoc]
03/06/03 12:57 PM
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I can second that. We had a new Thorobred bood mare that we turned in w/ the rest of the band too early  . They ran her right into the 2x4 no-climb@ full speed. She just bounced back. That is good stuff!
Eric
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SteveHCT
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
09/17/04 12:13 PM
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Mike - can you give me an update on the electric mesh tape? I see you've used it for quite a while. I posted over on the tractor forum about it as well. I'm considering using this as a primary fencing for my expanding pasture borders. Where the line won't move I intend to put in traditional vinyl or wood fencing, but the areas I'm still clearing seem like the perfect application for this fencing.
Thanks,
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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mfaley
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/17/04 04:38 PM
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Steve,
We dont use the tape for keeping horses in but I can say that I have seen both the tape and Centaur type fencing used and from what I have seen they both look good new and keep horses in (if not spooked) but start to look old and start to sag over time. With all due respect to Mike its not a solution I would use (Mike, not trying to step on your toes my friend. Just offering my 2 cents.)
It seems like there are 2 camps for horse fencing. One is going with a more traditional look like vinyl or wood and the others are the No Climb. I mean no offense to anyone but I have pretty strong feelings about how best to care for horses that God or others have entrusted to my care. In todays world I think one of the best fences is a tightly strung NoClimb with a hot wire running along the inside. Set it up with good strong bracing at the corners, stretch it tight as mentioned previously and you cant do much better to protect a horse. The only thing I would do differently is run a 1 or 2 rail pipe fence the whole way to reinforce it. There is a really good description of what this fence looks like in the TBN area with photos by WroughtnHarv.
I know some don't like the looks of it but for me its what makes the most sense for the horse.
Mark
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RichZ
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/17/04 06:06 PM
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I'm glad you brought this thread back up. I forgot to mention, that as per Cowboydoc's suggestion, I use the Red Brand fencing, and TSC carries it, and TSC's prices on it are the cheapest I've seen by far.
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
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SteveHCT
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
09/17/04 09:25 PM
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I bookmarked their site, based on one of the old posts. I'll take a look at it again. Mostly what I want now is a good long term-temporary ( if there is such a thing ) solution until we finalyze our pastures borders.
Thanks,
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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SteveHCT
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: mfaley]
09/17/04 09:27 PM
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I read on the other forum that someone might use them for a couple weeks - I would be likely using them in a temporary capacity... temporary for about a year. You think they won't hold up too well huh... Is there ever an easy answer??? 
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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LazyJ_Arabians
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/17/04 11:02 PM
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The key factor in deciding on how much beef to put into a fence is whether it will separate horses or just contain them. Given adequate pasture, horses will seldom even touch a containment-only fence except to scratch their tails. A separation fence line must be much more significant.
My largest pasture is slowly expanding on two opposite sides as I reclaim from scrub, brush, and swamp. For this I use T-posts with 4' large weave field fence thats cheap and easy to setup, just put some good stretching points every 200' or so and you've got it whipped. For my permanent containment-only perimeter fences I use the same construction but add a steel cable on the top for a sight line and to firm up the fence. My separation fences are mostly 6" round posts (some still 5" from my first failure) with crosstie corners and stretch points with no-climb mesh and cable on top and they take a brutal beating, I wish I had all crosstie posts in these areas.
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SteveHCT
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Thanks for the information. Non of my fencing will be to separate horses, containment only. The fact is, the pasture they're in now has some breaks in the fencing and they don't challenge it. So I don't think they're in any rush to break out anyway. If you had a chance I'd like to see a picture of how your fencing is set up. I find that like so many things, everyone seems to go about it in their own way. In the long term I planned on putting up vinyl fencing around the whole perimeter - but that's a good year or two away. Right now, some of these more moveable options are sounding very good.
Take Care,
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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MikePA
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/21/04 03:59 PM
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Mike - can you give me an update on the electric mesh tape?
Steve, the original tape I installed as a 'hot wire' on the inside top rail of my wooden fence is still working well after 10 years. No degradation of the tape. The only thing that's happened to the tape, which is white, is some of the tape has developed greenish tint from mold (?). It's not noticable unless I am close to the tape, so I have not done anything about it. In fact, the original Parmak 6v solar charger is still going strong.
The 3 acre pasture I fenced in this summer with horseguardfence cost $2.62/foot (price includes the horseguardfence items and the 4" x 4" x 8' posts that I spaced about 8 feet apart) for 3 strands. My fence is strictly for containment, not separation.
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
09/22/04 09:15 PM
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Thanks Mike - I think we'll be using this for our moving borders. I appreciate the information. I'm intrigued by the solar charger, I just am concerned about down time on it... cloudy days or worse, rainy days. How does it carry on when you have a few days of rainy weather?
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/23/04 09:07 AM
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I answered this one by going to the website (novel idea huh?). For anyone interested here is an excerpt;
Will operate for 21 days in total darkness. Totally weather-proof for outdoor use. Comes complete with sealed 6 volt battery, ready for use. Charges up to 25 miles of fence
Pretty Impressive...
Steve Mann
Salem, CT
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: SteveHCT]
09/23/04 09:49 AM
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The power drain on a charger is minimal unless you are discharging (like if you have a short or something is leaning against the wire). All the solar ones have batteries. It's a pretty ideal application for it.
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
10/16/05 11:39 PM
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Why bolt the wood boards to the T-posts? Just use 12.5 gauge twisted smooth wire. I have three rows of this wire, with two rows of electric tape between the smooth wire. I have my smooth wire tied into my fence ground in a "hot ground" setup. That way, dry soil is not that big a deal. If the horse touches the electric tape, it will also touch the smooth wire, which completes the circuit and gives them a healthy shock. My gelding that used to go right through fences now won't even go near it.
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: AK_Mike]
10/17/05 09:52 AM
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One comment I had regarding the horse touching their nose to the fence to test it....
Get a fence tester with multiple neon lights on it to check your voltage, it must be really low if the horse will do that. I bought ours for less than $10 at the local farm supply store.
Maybe your ground rod isn't making good contact, maybe your line from charger to fence is corroded, maybe the fence charger is just old and weak.
But..an electric fence should zap them hard enough they don't even think of trying to get thru it should the power go out or the fence ground out a bit.
Our fence ( and I am certainly no expert at electric fences ) tests at 9000+ volts, and the animals won't even think of getting in contact with it. I have a Dexter bull that would just walk thru the fence before I got it hot, now he respects it and stays in.
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: MikePA]
11/26/05 10:53 PM
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T posts are an economical way to get your fencing started but in agreement with others, put plastic caps on them. I look at tensile wire as an accident waiting to happen even with electric or a tape to give the horse something to see.
Tape is not necessarily meant to hold a horse in should they run into it. As previously mentioned, tape should be used with a charge that will not be soon forgotten. I always introduce a new horse to a fence by deliberately getting them to touch the fence in a "safe" area.
I have Centaur for my stallions and my outdoor arena. I figure the Centaur looks similar to the show arena fencing. For the rest, I have tape. I have treated posts that were pounded into the ground. They are heavy enough to upgrade if I ever choose or can afford to. I have some 10,000 feet of fence so tape was reasonable. The Centaur (and there are other brands as well) is encapsulated high tensile wire but is safe in this form. A horse could hit this full tilt and the fence would spring out then bounce the horse back in with normally only a bruise if that. But then anything is possible with horses. I consider this type of fence to be as safe as woven wire except for perhaps a foal slipping under it. It is pricey though.
I have even subdivided one Centaur paddock with six rows of tape in order to accomodate a thourobred gelding with my arab stallion. The tape kept them at bay until they got to know each other. For once in his life, my stallion has a buddy!
I am not however, happy with my particular tapes hardware life. After seven years, the plastic clips are breaking down. The corner connectors changed from my first purchase to use less material I suppose and are also breaking down. Also, the various pieces are not available seperately so you end up with useless parts that could be reused otherwise. The tape has not been to bad considering my windy location. Mostly, the deer damage it on occasion. My intention is to switch brands as I need to replace it.
The Centaur fasteners up close look not so new but are not breaking down. Centaur needs to be installed correctly and kept tight. A strip of power or the newer powered Centaur will keep the horses from pushing on it in their quest for greener pastures.
There is also a woven rope such as Electrobraid that I hear good things about.
If your horse pushes on your gates, string a single tape across the top from post to post with handles so you can remove it for access. Just don't let it touch the gate.
One more thought. Most of my four row fence is not central to my barns so the ground must travel a long way back to the charger. In dry times, the charge was very weak. I made the 3rd row up from the bottom into a ground and installed ground rods here and there. The theory is that an animal is more likely to touch the 3rd and 4th (top) row than the others. The charge will get a better ground and be strong. The other three rows will still work as usual by grounding back to the charger.
Just my two cents.
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mffarmall
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Reged: 01/06/06
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Posts: 33
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Loc: Colorado
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: RichZ]
01/09/06 01:12 PM
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Welcome to the west. Back east you guys usually use (traditionally) wood and we use pipe. Mostly because of all the drilling out here. But around where I am T post is king. I would use a 7.5 footer and space them 10 to 15 feet. Use three or four runs. You will need to use straight wire, barbs in bad for horses, ( I used barbed for cows and for when my mother in law visits) There are things called spacers they are just twisted wire that goes between the post and gives support for the fence. If any of your friends ask about your strange wire fence just tell them your from California and all will be explained. You will need to get a wire puller. This takes up the tention in the fence. Remember to put a wooden H at the end of the fence to take up the tension and keep the fence from falling over.
I have 6 acres in Colorado and plan on raising some butcher cows for meat and have a few horses
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Pat
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Reged: 09/15/02
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Loc: SouthCentral Oklahoma
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: mffarmall]
01/13/06 09:46 PM
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The twisted wire thingies are also known as "stays."
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
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Bird
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Reged: 09/12/02
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Loc: Corinth, TX, USA
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Re: Using T-Posts for Fencing
[re: Pat]
01/14/06 06:27 AM
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In reply to:
The twisted wire thingies are also known as "stays."
Yep, and if they're nice, new, clean ones, they go on real easy; just put the palm of your hand on top, push down, and they spin right on there. And if they're old, rusty ones . . . you only use them if you absolutely have to.
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