|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Water Hydrant Problem
02/08/04 06:00 AM
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
We have two standard water hydrants (lift up handle) in the barn. The water line is 3 feet under ground. As cold as it's been here, the ground has been frozen and the hydrants have worked just fine.
On Friday, we got almost 2 inches of rain and the barn got a good deal of water including at the base of the hydrant we use most of the time.
This morning it doesn't work.  Lift up on the handle, the little plunger rod moves up, but no water.
My guess is that because the ground is saturated, the stand pipe can not drain and it's frozen (18 degrees F last night).
Assuming this to be correct, are there alternatives to these hydrants? Will this one start working once it un-freezes?
BTW, the other hydrant works fine.
The water line comes from our house, to the first hydrant (the one that still works) then to the second one (the one that does not work) where the line terminates.
Post Extras:
|
|
cowboydoc
|
|
Veteran Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/11/02
|
|
Posts: 642
|
|
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/08/04 08:45 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Mike get one of those propane torches and just heat up and down on the exposed pipe. It may take 15 minutes or so but it will thaw out. To prevent this in the future we put a piece of 4" pvc pipe with a cap on it that the hydrant goes through. This way the pipe is protected and you also protect the line from getting soaked with water and freezing.
Post Extras:
|
|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: cowboydoc]
02/08/04 09:07 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Thanks, doc. I will try the torch.
Update: I tried the torch and it's working now but I have a dumb question...  where is it best to concentrate the heat, right at ground level? There's 3 feet of pipe sticking out of the ground.
Also, I opened the spigot before I applied the heat.
About the 4" pipe, do you have a picture? Do you just slide it down and let it sit on the ground, or do you run the PVC pipe into the ground?
Post Extras:
|
|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/09/04 07:48 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Well, my wife called me at work and both hydrants are frozen this morning (18 degrees F last night). She tried lifting the handles on both hydrants and neither would budge. Wisely, she didn't try and force them.
I think this confirms my suspicion that the ground is saturated down at the depth where the hydrant is supposed to drain. The water has no where to go so it stays in the pipe, then freezes. Guess what I will be doing when I get home from work? Yep, getting the torch out again. Day time temps in the 40s today, maybe it will thaw on its own?
I will stop and get some heat tape and wrap the pipes with that, maybe that will eliminate the morning torch routine. 
Post Extras:
|
|
cowboydoc
|
|
Veteran Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/11/02
|
|
Posts: 642
|
|
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/09/04 11:58 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Mike,
Did you put the hydrants in? If so did you put about a foot of gravel around the drain at the end of the hydrant? This lets the water drain away from the hydrant. As to the pvc we put it into the ground all the way down. This also acts as heat for the pipe. That cold ground when it's wet touching the sides of the hydrant will freeze it pretty quick.
Post Extras:
|
|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: cowboydoc]
02/09/04 12:20 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Hi doc,
No, I did not install them, but two times I've dug them out to re-attached the plastic supply line when it's detached. There's no gravel at the bottom of the hole.
I bought a heat tape and some pipe insulation I'm going to try on the hydrant the horses can't get to, i.e., chew on.
Post Extras:
|
|
Chippy
|
|
New Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 02/02/04
|
|
Posts: 16
|
|
Loc: Endless Mts, PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/09/04 02:41 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Hi Mike,
This may not be an option for you. I have a frost free hydrant. When we put it in we could only get the end of the line down about 2 feet. (we hit rock ledge). It stays pretty good until temps stay below 15 or so for a few days.
Our supply line also comes from our house. I have a shut off and drain inside the basement so I can turn off supply and drain it back when needed. It takes an extra minute to go to the basement to turn on the water before going to the barn, but I haven't had to thaw pipes since I started doing it.
I haven't run any stock the past several winters so it gets very little use when its cold anyway. Just a thought. Good luck! 
The best thing you can do to avoid frozen pipes is move to Mexico!  Its been a tough winter here!
Live to Fish, Fish to Live!
Post Extras:
|
|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: Chippy]
02/09/04 04:44 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Hi Todd,
I have a shut off and drain inside the basement so I can turn off supply and drain it back when needed.
We have a shut off in our basement, too, but I hope it doesn't come to that. 
Post Extras:
|
|
Stoneheartfarm
|
|
Veteran Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 10/10/02
|
|
Posts: 792
|
|
Loc: West Central Michigan
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/10/04 10:00 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
I watched while the guy installed our hydrants. He didn't use gravel either, instead he used a section of 6" PVC and set the bottom of the hydrant on top of it. Then he wrapped several layers of thick plastic over it and buried it. I asked him why and he said it provides more sump room than gravel and seems to drain better. He claims to have never had one freeze up.
Ours is buried 5' and the portion that gets plowed has 5" of foam over the plastic line.
Steve
Post Extras:
|
|
RichZ
|
|
Veteran Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/12/02
|
|
Posts: 558
|
|
Loc: Cambridge, New York in beautiful Washington County, next to Vermont
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
02/23/04 02:37 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Mike, I had the exact same problem. I have two hydrants, one in the barn, and one outside, and they both were frozen. I dug down about three feet in the one in the barn and wrapped heat tape around it, and then wrapped foam around the pipe to keep the heat in. It's worked fine since then.
Rich
"What a long strange trip it's been."
Post Extras:
|
|
MikePA
|
|
Gold Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 09/10/02
|
|
Posts: 338
|
|
Loc: Southern PA
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: RichZ]
02/25/04 06:41 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Enough water must have drained from around the pipe because after a day or two of having to unfreeze it with the MAPP torch, it's been fine ever since. This summer I will dig it out and install something permanent.
Post Extras:
|
|
jerri2222
|
|
New Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 12/08/08
|
|
Posts: 1
|
|
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
12/08/08 10:50 AM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
My handle won't budge unless I get a torch....
It seems to freeze at the top part....The water is draining at the bottom ...so I can't figure out what is wrong with this.... worked fine all last winter.... the little plunger thing is frozen in place and when i torch it , it seems Fine... It's a Clayton Mark type...
The repair kit doesn't look like it will help from the pictures of the parts they show...
ANY good idea's...before my wife kills me for being in the barn an hour a DAY for a horse ?
JERRY
516 635 98465 jerri2222@aol.com
Post Extras:
|
|
QRTRHRS
|
|
Member
|
|
|
|
|
Reged: 11/26/05
|
|
Posts: 92
|
|
Loc: Casey County, KY
|
|
Re: Water Hydrant Problem
[re: MikePA]
01/07/09 11:42 PM
|
|
Edit
|
Reply
|
|
|
Having grown up and spent a good portion of my life in Pa, I have to question a pipe freezing in southern PA if it is buried three feet deep.
At my last farm in the Tamaqua area, I buried the hydrants four feet deep that I installed but there was an existing one in the one barn that was only three feet. I had hydrants that were not protected from the wind and I did have some wind at that location.
You need to understand how these valves work. the actual valve is at the bottom of the pipe with a drain hole. When you shut off that valve lever, the water drains out of the pipe through that hole. There must be a means for that water to displace.
I do not believe that the frost line has gotten below say two feet in southern PA lately if that? While some cold will conduct down that pipe, I tend to think that with proper drainage, you should not have a frozen valve.
The lever mechinism will freeze. I have had to use hot water, a blow dryer or torch on that. Over time, the rod that runs the length of the pipe will get dry and or the adjustment bolt that secures it to the handle will loosen too. You might try lubricating the rod with some vegetable oil also.
FWIW, I would use two stainless clamps on the plastic pipe over brass nipples on the bottom of the hydrant. The clamps should be 180 degrees out of alignment as far as the tightening screws are located. With brass nipples, heating the pipe is usually necessary to slip it on followed by secureing the clamps while the plastic pipe is still soft. Black pipe is harder to eliminate any drips then the newer blue pipe is. I forget the name but the blue pipe has an opaque inner layer and is more difficult to evenly heat.
I like it as I have heard that over time, the black pipe can leach different compounds into the water.
I know of no other alternative to the hydrants for open air or unheated space use. Mostly, people do little to maintain them until there is an issue.
Post Extras:
|
Previous
Index
Next
Flat
Threaded